BDs, how do you deal with random skirmish/gank/PvP

[LucyfurZaana]

i posted this exact same question in the dwarf section forums, and luckily was able to get some very appreciated and insightful knowledge when experiencing pvp as a dorfZor.

i'd like to hear some similar thoughts on this as a BD. i've recently subbed this DE support fighter and would like to learn on how to go about this and be successful (not always but atleast be able to hold on my own if i can). playing a dorf for such a long time, its a little different playing a BD knowing that I dont have the CON, and neither the weight capacity to carry much.

would love to hear tactics/strategies from other BDs that play them as their mains, will appreciate it.

(currently not wearing any tats, dont plan on, seem to be balanced as is, sitting on LvL59)

/thanks & regards

[Jacent]

I only have a level 58 BD, but being that I am in a wartag heavy clan that has left me PVP'ing more than I probably had hoped for. For me it comes done two one of two conditions: am I with a group or solo?

- If I am in a group I make sure dances are up, pick out the archer or nuker that looks like they are packing the best gear, and commence with the Aggression spam. I figure that I can't do much damage compared to my clanmates so if I can soak some hits then that's a far better tactic then me just standing there. If they(wartags) have a healer(rare) then I'll charge then and act like I'm going to do some damage or something. Whatever I can do in my own little way to buy us some time that's what I'll try.

- If I am solo then my #1 concern is closing on them and closing the distance as fast as possible. I don't carry a bow so that means I need to get up in their grill and hope that my taking the initiative means something. For whatever reason most people seem to hesitate when they see wartags so I just try to dive in their and hope that I can fluster them or catch them before they can kind of process what's going on.

I know that all of that sounds really simplistic, but it's the best I got. BD's don't really set the World on fire with, "omgwth just happened to me?!1?shift-one!" burst damage so I just try to act as decisively as this n00b can in the hopes that someone else is slow on the draw. A few lucky crits, some suprised folks not being able to find their CP pots, and a lot of praying is about all I got at this level.

[Rainy92]

BladeDancer 101:

Lets first talk aboout skills you will use and some that you wont.

Use: Arrest ( enchant chance ) Freezing strike ( enchant chance ) Hex (Enchant Chance ), Power Break (Enchant Chance) Dance of Medusa, Ultimate Defense, And your Dances (buff dances and resist dances and Shadow) ( Enchant at least +1 for cost I'll explain later). Take the rest, (Poison Blade Dance, sting, etc) and chuck them off your bars.

You will want to enchant your dances to +1 in order to make them lvl 76 skills. This will make it difficult to remove them with cancellation skills. EX: Dance of Fire, lvl 40 @ +0 skill enchant. Lvl 76 at +1 Skill enchant.

Next we'll talk about your gear. Grab either some haste duals or chrono maracas, and a Drac bow w/ focus SA. in an archer team. or, grab S duals in a mage team. Before you think im kidding, chrono maracas has almost no weight, therefore allowing you to carry more pots into a pvp. And yes i land medusa with maracas.
Your armor set should be Tallum Heavy or IC heavy or Maj Heavy. Preference is up to you. I like IC -> Tallum -> Maj. Your tatoo set up should be +4 str -2 dex or -2con. OR +4 str -4 Dex. I guess ill reveal what i use since im retiring my BD. And before people tell you to go -5 CON ask them when the last time they went 42-2 in class specific olympiad. I used -4 dex in oly and -2 dex -2 con when im not camping olympiad.

Your actions in PVP should be #1 to dance for your party, no matter in small gank groups or large skirmishes, your job is to give your primary DD's dances. You now hove choices. I personally like to play aggresive, switch to bow and start putting damage on targets. There is a right way to do this and a wrong way to do this. The wrong way is to think you are a DD and gonna rack up GG kills left and right. Don't hit targets that are 900 range from you party, you dont have the range to do that. find close targets, and make the judgement call. always remember your dances are the most important piece of your char. If you are dead you can't quite dance.

The right way, find close target and players who have no idea what they are doing and put some damage on them. if the targets your archers are shooting is close enough, assist your main assist. once you pass your archer to hit a target, you know its outside your range. get good a gauging distances and using your radar. Use skills on players who come in too close or go after your party's healer, arrest, freezing strike etc. get hex on players in range. Using Medusa is also important and knowing when to use it. It only works on flagged targets, and many BD jump the gun. I personally attempt a medusa on a flagged healer, or a cluster of DD's. Timing is important, and choosing your targets to medusa. And Epics always help. enjoy.

Legendary Retired SD-
Rainday.

[Zestos]

listen to rainday-he hurts

[Ramaya]

Rainday was full of weaksauce and not a good BD at all.

Rikku0 is where it was at.

[DevilStar]

[ QUOTE ]
Rikku0 is where it was at.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL67BDINDOOMHEAVY

[Ramaya]

+6 DOOM HEAVY YOU HATER

[AshleyHunter]

Why are your retiring your BD ?

[KnightOfDarkness]

The easiet way to deal with a skirmish or gank is to BSOE
;)

[LucyfurZaana]

[ QUOTE ]
Why are your retiring your BD ?

[/ QUOTE ]

good question. i was thinking the same thing mate, your info that you have posted up is VERY helpful. but y the early retirement??

[DevilStar]

He rerolled to paladin

[DPS]

[ QUOTE ]
The easiet way to deal with a skirmish or gank is to BSOE
;)

[/ QUOTE ]

haha very true!

[styx]

[ QUOTE ]
I only have a level 58 BD, but being that I am in a wartag heavy clan that has left me PVP'ing more than I probably had hoped for. For me it comes done two one of two conditions: am I with a group or solo?

- If I am in a group I make sure dances are up, pick out the archer or nuker that looks like they are packing the best gear, and commence with the Aggression spam. I figure that I can't do much damage compared to my clanmates so if I can soak some hits then that's a far better tactic then me just standing there. If they(wartags) have a healer(rare) then I'll charge then and act like I'm going to do some damage or something. Whatever I can do in my own little way to buy us some time that's what I'll try.

- If I am solo then my #1 concern is closing on them and closing the distance as fast as possible. I don't carry a bow so that means I need to get up in their grill and hope that my taking the initiative means something. For whatever reason most people seem to hesitate when they see wartags so I just try to dive in their and hope that I can fluster them or catch them before they can kind of process what's going on.

I know that all of that sounds really simplistic, but it's the best I got. BD's don't really set the World on fire with, "omgwth just happened to me?!1?shift-one!" burst damage so I just try to act as decisively as this n00b can in the hopes that someone else is slow on the draw. A few lucky crits, some suprised folks not being able to find their CP pots, and a lot of praying is about all I got at this level.

[/ QUOTE ]
Read that and then add this text to the beginning of every statement: Do Not Do.
I will post,when I get more time, why BD is one of the best classes in the game PvP/PvE - it doesn't matter; however it does take(above all the rest) the most time and patience. If you don't have either one of these then roll right now cause you won't ever survive.

[IceBunny]

[ QUOTE ]
BladeDancer 101:

Lets first talk aboout skills you will use and some that you wont.

Use: Arrest ( enchant chance ) Freezing strike ( enchant chance ) Hex (Enchant Chance ), Power Break (Enchant Chance) Dance of Medusa, Ultimate Defense, And your Dances (buff dances and resist dances and Shadow) ( Enchant at least +1 for cost I'll explain later). Take the rest, (Poison Blade Dance, sting, etc) and chuck them off your bars.

You will want to enchant your dances to +1 in order to make them lvl 76 skills. This will make it difficult to remove them with cancellation skills. EX: Dance of Fire, lvl 40 @ +0 skill enchant. Lvl 76 at +1 Skill enchant.

Next we'll talk about your gear. Grab either some haste duals or chrono maracas, and a Drac bow w/ focus SA. in an archer team. or, grab S duals in a mage team. Before you think im kidding, chrono maracas has almost no weight, therefore allowing you to carry more pots into a pvp. And yes i land medusa with maracas.
Your armor set should be Tallum Heavy or IC heavy or Maj Heavy. Preference is up to you. I like IC -> Tallum -> Maj. Your tatoo set up should be +4 str -2 dex or -2con. OR +4 str -4 Dex. I guess ill reveal what i use since im retiring my BD. And before people tell you to go -5 CON ask them when the last time they went 42-2 in class specific olympiad. I used -4 dex in oly and -2 dex -2 con when im not camping olympiad.

Your actions in PVP should be #1 to dance for your party, no matter in small gank groups or large skirmishes, your job is to give your primary DD's dances. You now hove choices. I personally like to play aggresive, switch to bow and start putting damage on targets. There is a right way to do this and a wrong way to do this. The wrong way is to think you are a DD and gonna rack up GG kills left and right. Don't hit targets that are 900 range from you party, you dont have the range to do that. find close targets, and make the judgement call. always remember your dances are the most important piece of your char. If you are dead you can't quite dance.

The right way, find close target and players who have no idea what they are doing and put some damage on them. if the targets your archers are shooting is close enough, assist your main assist. once you pass your archer to hit a target, you know its outside your range. get good a gauging distances and using your radar. Use skills on players who come in too close or go after your party's healer, arrest, freezing strike etc. get hex on players in range. Using Medusa is also important and knowing when to use it. It only works on flagged targets, and many BD jump the gun. I personally attempt a medusa on a flagged healer, or a cluster of DD's. Timing is important, and choosing your targets to medusa. And Epics always help. enjoy.

Legendary Retired SD-
Rainday.

[/ QUOTE ]

THIS IS ALL TRUE. 100% of it.
.
.
.
cept our OP is lvl 59.

Dances and Hex, keep it up.

[Savian]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I will post,when I get more time, why BD is one of the best classes in the game PvP/PvE - it doesn't matter; however it does take(above all the rest) the most time and patience.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well waiting on that one...

[LucyfurZaana]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I will post,when I get more time, why BD is one of the best classes in the game PvP/PvE - it doesn't matter; however it does take(above all the rest) the most time and patience.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well waiting on that one...

[/ QUOTE ]

you took the words right out of my keyboard. I logged in just to type that. :)

and yes, would love to hear more insight.

/regards.

[styx]

Sorry guys, work is busy right now, haven't had time - although I've written it down on paper lolz.
First thing though, I would like to talk about IceBunny's quote real quick.
Why are you promoting the notion that enhancing skills for chance is gonna help you with when you should be landing (provided you have spirit shots of your grade) anyways? The only reason that you don't hit with your spells is if your trying to take on ppl that are +3 or more above you lvl. Thats just ludicrous advice in my opinion. But I can understand your positon due to the fact that you're PvP experience has been Group vs Group. Your advice is hugely bias twords this scenario (especially with your tat arrangement). You must banking on tanking little to no damage at all : \
Do not chuck ANYTHING off your bars. Every skill you have is useful in its own way and in their own circumstance. You have all the slots you need to be as versatile as you should be. Your a Blade Dancer. Your neither a nuker or a tank. But you have aspects of both - so to be the most effective you need to use both. If you start cutting away your skillset then your ganking yourself. Instead of cutting them away I suggest that you learn their value.
LoL Maracas? This whole post is about fighting and defending youself in a skirmish/gank situation - These suggestions need to be put in the "how to be a buffer" section cause they don't belong here. Having said that I really appreciate your fighting methodology and I adopt it without a doubt. Haste Duel's and Drac bow of course are on the menu and I totally agree.
Again I know that this is by no means a comprehensive analysis and I hope that by way of debate on these issues it helps to give others a more rounded understanding of the BD class and its strengths and weaknesses. I would like to follow up on the skills subject more because I find that there are preconceptions that need to be addressed when it comes to what, where, and more importantly why we use skills and enchanting solutions to bridge the cap between us and the other classes advantages over us.

thx. I hope to post more in the VERY near future.

[Rainy92]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry guys, work is busy right now, haven't had time - although I've written it down on paper lolz.
First thing though, I would like to talk about IceBunny's quote real quick.
Why are you promoting the notion that enhancing skills for chance is gonna help you with when you should be landing (provided you have spirit shots of your grade) anyways? The only reason that you don't hit with your spells is if your trying to take on ppl that are +3 or more above you lvl. Thats just ludicrous advice in my opinion. But I can understand your positon due to the fact that you're PvP experience has been Group vs Group. Your advice is hugely bias twords this scenario (especially with your tat arrangement). You must banking on tanking little to no damage at all : \
Do not chuck ANYTHING off your bars. Every skill you have is useful in its own way and in their own circumstance. You have all the slots you need to be as versatile as you should be. Your a Blade Dancer. Your neither a nuker or a tank. But you have aspects of both - so to be the most effective you need to use both. If you start cutting away your skillset then your ganking yourself. Instead of cutting them away I suggest that you learn their value.
LoL Maracas? This whole post is about fighting and defending youself in a skirmish/gank situation - These suggestions need to be put in the "how to be a buffer" section cause they don't belong here. Having said that I really appreciate your fighting methodology and I adopt it without a doubt. Haste Duel's and Drac bow of course are on the menu and I totally agree.
Again I know that this is by no means a comprehensive analysis and I hope that by way of debate on these issues it helps to give others a more rounded understanding of the BD class and its strengths and weaknesses. I would like to follow up on the skills subject more because I find that there are preconceptions that need to be addressed when it comes to what, where, and more importantly why we use skills and enchanting solutions to bridge the cap between us and the other classes advantages over us.

thx. I hope to post more in the VERY near future.

[/ QUOTE ]

Let me address your concerns.
Skill enchantments on chance based skills should be enchanted for Chance. None of the BD skills are 100% even at lower levels. Im not sure what level your BD is, but mine is 79. anyways, just to go in depth and actually provide information, which i dont see you doing; let me explain further.

Freezing Strike Skill Enchantment Options:

Power
Cost
Chance
Surrender to water.

You use freezing strike for what reason? The skill is used to slow targets running away in most cases. Therefore, Power (add a small amount of m attak) Cost ( i hope noone argues to go cost ) CHANCE (chance to slow target) Surrender to water (far to niche ). You tell me chance is not the best option.

Hex skill enchantment options:
Cost
Chance
Add attack

A bd uses Hex to lower p def of a target. You want this to land and no it is not 100% land rate at equal or even lower level targets. Cost (why?) Add attack ( you want to add a tiny bit of damage when you hex?) CHANCE ( success rate of skill is increased) come on dude. You got to be kidding me.

Why chuck skills off your bars? Because there are some skills which do not make sense to use in pvp. Just because u have a skills doesnt mean its useful to you. If i saw you come close enough to my party and risk being killed to throw up a poison blade dance, i would seriously laugh. Sting is alright, but when you are at end game and everyone has resist bleed / poison epics, theres really no reason to choose to come into melee range to use sting vs. the chance to get a 2k crit on the same target from range with a bow.

You are a bladedancer. You are not a NUKER or a TANK or even a combination of BOTH. You are a party buffer. Enchanter Class. You use buffs. It just happens that your natural DE heritage endows you with high STR. Combined with the high P att of a BOW you have the ability to do some decent damage. In ct1.5 you get a arrow resist dance, which also happens to REDUCE the cost of shooting a bow. It just the mechanics of the game. lol @ bd being a combo tank/nuker. Now to be fair, there is the crit damage reduction that the BD gains from it being a Palus knight. But to argue that it gains a hybrid tank/caster status is rofl.

Maracas. Use them. BD = low con = low carrying capacity. Carrying a bow + arrows + shots + Duals + Greater cp pots + Cp Pots + -2 CON or even -5 CON = OVERWEIGHT. Add in Spirit ores for Blessing of Noblesse, hero skills if you gain hero and soul ores for hero skills makes it harder. Ofc usuing maracas only applies to certain situations. etc, sieges, group pvp, gank runs. etc. they majority of the time you will obvoiusly be carrying duals.

The point here is to cut out 1560 weight of duals. you can still party buff with and bring CP pots instead. LOL as long as youre not taking this guys advice and usuing EVERY oh so important skills, such as LOLSTING in pvp, you'll be fine with maracas.

In closing. Before you post again, please tell us. Are you noble? Have you ever fought and won Hero status? Where can i dowload your pvp video? What is your BD's name, because I keep up with most pro BD's and I have no idea who you are.

Thanks
-Rainday.

[Ramaya]

RAINDAY TEACHIN KIDZ ALL DAY LONG SON

[I_Faithkil]

I agree with 99.9% of what you said. the exception Sing I find it very useful aginst myistics.

[AshleyHunter]

But Ramaya didn't say it Rainday did O.o

[I_Faithkil]

you're right, I just used the quick reply box and it pulled the the last posters name.

[styx]

First - Don't operate under the impression that your lvl, a hero status, or pvp video's gets a rise out of me. Prehaps you might impress the younger

generation but L2 "achievements", if you can call them that, don't belong on a resume of things to bring up in a DEBATE discussion. Just focus on the points

at hand plz. Also my name has nothing to do with the debate on hand. Not giving you that information will allow us to focus on the points rather than silly

antics to try to gain ground twords an arguement that is very loosely backed up with facts(realizing that figures are hard to come by its not entirely "our"

faults).
Now that thats out of the way lets bring back to our viewers the topics at hand.
1) I never said that Hex or anything else lands 100% of the time so please re-read my position before you answer. Hex absolutely DOES land at least 90-95% of

the time when you cast with absps and your smart and fighting ppl that you can handle. So wow my friend, instead of telling our friends to spend all their

experience on other things that may add a little somthing extra to their skillset lets tell them to suck up all their xp in grabbing 1 or 2 extra percent in

landing their casts. I mean we all know what a big difference there is with percentages between 90-92% right?
2)The only useless skill there is to use in PvP is Vamipiric dance and if your big ol lvl can attest to that then we've already come a long way. I'm shocked

to hear that you feel in PvP that skills such as Demonic Dance are obsolete?? I mean they only take a spell casters MAtk down by what 600-800 at our lvl. No

ppl - please don't use that, you might become usefull.
3)your not a nuker or a tank? Wow, thanks for reiterating my position accurately for once. However a combination of both is exactly what this class is all

about. Why else can I crit a good %age of the time for 3k+ bow I wonder?. And if your so educated as to the abilities of "top" BD's then how about

suggesting that our viewers take a look at N0a because that is an excellent example of how to handle yourself as a BD? (and plz before you jump on that comment with a hard on I do understand that N0a uses his own skillset the way he is comfortable with it; I'm simply using him as an example of the fact that a BD can both take and give an aweful lot of damage - which eludes your comment's all together.
4)Maracas are dumb. Be useful for a change and do somthing more than just dances.

[DevilStar]

l2p

[Rainy92]

lol @ u. First off, I did get a rise out of you. 2nd off hex does not land 90-95% of the time at +0. 3rd I clearly stated i use a bow in my post to do dmg. 4th off, yes watch n0a's vids. hes a fine bd. lastly, plz count the times Demonic blade dance - poison blade dance are used in said bd vid. ( its Zero ) And how does that elude my comment, did you read my post.. I mean you did quote it. I said use a bow and put dmg on people. wow lol.

I asked you when you have accomplished such things because in order to give good advice about a class, means you should have some understanding and experience to back up what you are advising. Just my opinion on it. I would not assume to be posting under advice towards and SK or any other class for that matter because I dont have a credible foundation to offer guidance on such class. In this case, your refusal to sign your advice with your name, level, accomplishments is enough to ignore all future posts you make on commenting on the BD class.

Thanks.

[Tsukin]

In the ISUltimate vid at arround 9:40 n0a uses pbd twice (most probably cause theres also mobs there), at the start of the vid a bd also uses pbd, but thats pure pve.

He uses hex, freezing strike, life drain and sting a lot more frequent though.

[AshleyHunter]

Stop using Quick Reply I have no idea who talking to who till I read the whole thing and figure it out!

[styx]

First off I rarely, RARELY miss on Hex, so I don't know what your talking about. Bow - Yes you stated that, right after you said that BD's don't have any qualities of a DD or tank? You need to be a little less contradictory with your statements don't you think?. I told you as well that N0a uses a different skillset that is comfortable for him and that I was using him to prove my point - Namely: That BD's have attributes from both a DD and a Tank class. It doesn't get anymore simple than that to understand.
If you choose not to read my posts that will be a crying shame. /end-sarcasm.

[Kaizen]

Anyone else notice that styx seems to be actually focusing on the debate and posting his opinion and Rainy92 only seems concerned with trying to flame styx?

Try to keep it civil Rainy, this isn't high school.

[Ramaya]

did you notice that Rainy already correctly answered the questions asked by the OP, and styx is just a [censored] idiot who thinks hex lands 90-92% of the time at +0, and thinks you should enchant it for damage so you can hex someone for 98 damage. oh man, lookout. Sorry but no.

BD are not tanks. BD's are not Mages. Nor are they a mix of both. The are a BUFFER CLASS that can DAMAGE DEAL.

wow.

[Kaizen]

I can't speak for how well a BladeDancer can hex someone, but styx seems to be the only mature person in this thread and your post is proof of that.

If all you're doing is trying to create hostility in the thread, leave. I would actually like to see this turn in to a debate, because that would actually be beneficial to BD's who want to know this information.

Right now all it is, is Rainy stating his opinion, styx stating his, and then Rainy and you attempting to bash instead of creating a counter argument.

[Ramaya]

thats because he is an idiot.

Hi!

[Rainy92]

The original poster has already priv messaged me thanking me for my insight. This "debate" as you call it is not even a debate. there is no basis in which styx either attempts fully explain or give insight in the mechanics of his arguements. But if this is a debate; the original poster who created this thread asking for help, has choosen to subscribe to my way of thinking so I believe that means I effectively won this debate.

I didnt ask the questions of his lvl, status, experience as a flame. Lets be honest, people trust those who are accomplished. So why not give the advice based upon what you know and have done, not what you think you know.

the end.

[Kaizen]

Read through your posts again and note the amount of times you made an attack or tried to belittle styx's comments because you personally don't know who he is and you'll see what I'm talking about.

I admit that since the OP has thanked you for your advice, that it seems what you're saying is valid, but what you need to work on is your attitude. There are ways to correct someone without a personal attack.

[AshleyHunter]

[ QUOTE ]
I can't speak for how well a BladeDancer can hex someone, but styx seems to be the only mature person in this thread and your post is proof of that.

If all you're doing is trying to create hostility in the thread, leave. I would actually like to see this turn in to a debate, because that would actually be beneficial to BD's who want to know this information.

Right now all it is, is Rainy stating his opinion, styx stating his, and then Rainy and you attempting to bash instead of creating a counter argument.

[/ QUOTE ]


I'm mature :p

[Jacent]

[ QUOTE ]
I admit that since the OP has thanked you for your advice, that it seems what you're saying is valid, but what you need to work on is your attitude. There are ways to correct someone without a personal attack.

[/ QUOTE ]

Really? You might want to tell "styx" that...

[ QUOTE ]
Read that and then add this text to the beginning of every statement: Do Not Do.
I will post,when I get more time, why BD is one of the best classes in the game PvP/PvE - it doesn't matter; however it does take(above all the rest) the most time and patience. If you don't have either one of these then roll right now cause you won't ever survive.

[/ QUOTE ]

At no point did "styx" counter anything I said, they just said "Do Not Do", went off on some tangent, and then got into it with Rainy. You know...because winning arguments on the internet means something.

I gave my opinion on how to deal with PVP in an effort to answer the OP to the best of my admittedly limited ability and styx has yet to explain why I should be chided for doing so. Hell, at this point I'm thinking that he didn't even read my post. Why? If he had he'd know my BD is, as I said, level 58. Most of the PVP situations I have encountered have been versus S-graders. I he is so **** smart maybe he can illuminate the issue of how I can better deal with fighting Drac bow wielding level 76+ toons. Yeah, that should be a good one.

My bet? Yeah, he didn't even bother reading. He just wanted to flex his wicked cool L2 forum muscle (http://s163696184.onlinehome.us/dalaran/images/thrad.jpg).

[Kaizen]

Just going to post a little reference here.

styx compliments to others:

[ QUOTE ]
But I can understand your positon due to the fact that you're PvP experience has been Group vs Group.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Having said that I really appreciate your fighting methodology and I adopt it without a doubt. Haste Duel's and Drac bow of course are on the menu and I totally agree.

[/ QUOTE ]

Those were while 'disproving' your claim.

styx possible flame:

[ QUOTE ]
LoL Maracas? This whole post is about fighting and defending youself in a skirmish/gank situation - These suggestions need to be put in the "how to be a buffer" section cause they don't belong here.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is the only thing that could be construed as a flame in his post referring to your (Jacent)'s post.

Here are styx's flames in response to Rainy's post.

[ QUOTE ]
The only useless skill there is to use in PvP is Vamipiric dance and if your big ol lvl can attest to that then we've already come a long way. I'm shocked

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
your not a nuker or a tank? Wow, thanks for reiterating my position accurately for once. However a combination of both is exactly what this class is all

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
And if your so educated as to the abilities of "top" BD's then how about

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
If you choose not to read my posts that will be a crying shame. /end-sarcasm.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now here are Rainy's flames. Note that I did not include any of his sarcastic comments that were definitely on the edge of flamy, because that doubled this list.

Also note that I was not able to find any compliment or even admission that some of styx's tactics could be valid.

[ QUOTE ]
dd attack ( you want to add a tiny bit of damage when you hex?) CHANCE ( success rate of skill is increased) come on dude. You got to be kidding me.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
If i saw you come close enough to my party and risk being killed to throw up a poison blade dance, i would seriously laugh.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
lol @ bd being a combo tank/nuker.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
But to argue that it gains a hybrid tank/caster status is rofl.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
you can still party buff with and bring CP pots instead. LOL as long as youre not taking this guys advice and usuing EVERY oh so important skills, such as LOLSTING in pvp, you'll be fine with maracas.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
In closing. Before you post again, please tell us. Are you noble? Have you ever fought and won Hero status? Where can i dowload your pvp video? What is your BD's name, because I keep up with most pro BD's and I have no idea who you are.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
In this case, your refusal to sign your advice with your name, level, accomplishments is enough to ignore all future posts you make on commenting on the BD class.

[/ QUOTE ]


Just figured I would enlighten.

I would also like to note that although styx did flame in response to flames, which I do not agree with (An eye for an eye would leave the world blind -- Gandhi) but he did make his first post clean and in good nature.


*edited because I attempted to add names to the quotes but failed. Seems the BBCode on here is different than other forums.*

[Ramaya]

if you even consider half of those flames, then you are obviously new to the intarnetz

[Kaizen]

Why do you keep coming back here? You do nothing but try to instigate things.

I'm sorry if I believe people should treat people online as if they were speaking face to face. Imagine that, I keep my morals online.

*edit* Oh look at that, I actually threw a bit of sarcasm in there :/

[Ramaya]

because i can.

[DevilStar]

[ QUOTE ]
First off I rarely, RARELY miss on Hex

[/ QUOTE ]

Are these people wearing anything better than Elven or Black Ore jewellery?

I promise you my friend on an adequately geared target with unenchanted hex for chance you will NOT be landing hex anything close to 90%.

I'd like to ask at what level of pvp you have competed in most recently and yes, that means I am asking your characters level and the level of the other players you have been fighting because properly buffed high level players do not suffer from magic based debuffs from a fighter class very often.

[Blauw]

riky and fs r such trolls even spamming here

[styx]

ok im tired of this. for those that don't know how to count this will be difficult for you to understand but here goes:
BladeDancer lvl 7x with lvl 7x prophet buffs has an Matk of somewhere in the range of 550.
550 + spirit shots = close to double = but for argueing purposes we'll say around 1100?? matk.(now unless you have the official spirit shot boost numbers don't bother flaming).
I couldn't find a setup character that would provide more than 1200 mdef with tass jewls and the equivalent buffs that I had.(take this into account when you flame or risk looking stupid).now provided you know the EXACT calculations I will intercede with the basics here: 1100/1200 = 91%
Now unless you have other calculations that will do anything else but blow smoke than post. I land Hex 90% of the time. Enough said already.
Note* to all you ebayers running around with epics I can understand your confusion. You should try playin legit for once then you would understand the mathematics behind all this.
Note**Now some are wondering whether bonus's that you would get from armor's such as -50% this or that would help?
Absolutely the only problem is that S grade Arcana robes don't help with root unfortunately only stun. I've taken these figures from A mage class because this provides the most Mdef rating that I can achieve as well as the fact that most players choose Nuker classes under the guise that they are the best pvp class and require less skill to play to which they're only half right. You can bring the stats from other classes at various lvl's - and that would be much appreciated to round out the discussion but this won't lessen the weight of my arguements due to the fact that I'm not going to debate the stats of EVERY toon on L2. I don't have that kind of time.
Note***It's also not logical to believe that because the MDef is higher even slightly that Hex won't land at all? Probability is calculated on how close the stats are; Explicit calculations would yield 0 land rate - which proves that 90% is at least more closer to the percentage of probability than anything else you can come up with.

[DevilStar]

Your argument might be slightly more credible if the land rate of debuffs were dependent solely on m.atk vs m.def. Now in case you didn't know there is a stat which offers a resistence to debuffs, this stat is known as MEN (it used to be WIT but this was changed in C5 IIRC) which you have failed to take into account.

Now as different races have different levels of MEN some will have more of a resistence than others meaning that your 90% or 91% land rate is simply a number you pulled out of your [censored], or may as well have been pulled from there.

Hex does not land on a buffed s grade wearing toon anywhere close to 90%, especially if your BD is only using prophet buffs.

I'm sorry but you are wrong.

[Ramaya]

i laugh at your "ebayer" comment for epic jewels.

Im sorry you were never in an alliance that farmed epic raid bosses. Hey niether was i, but still. They are out there.

And you are so, so wrong, btw.

[Ramaya]

btw.

Here are the stats of my 78 Elven elder, actually buffed for pvp. Not like the 58 pp buff people you will be fighting at your lvl im sure.

HP 8035 CP 1852
MP 4027
P.Atk. 406 M.Atk. 1130
P.Def. 1272 M.Def. 1910
Accuracy 116 Evasion 99
Critical 49 Speed 141
Atk. Spd. 472 Casting Spd. 1857

Buffs are as follows.

btb
bts
Shield
accumen
wind walk
G.shield
M.Barrier
Dance of Mystic
Dance of Concentration
Dance of Siren

( these bd dances can change, depending on party, but conc will always stay )

Song of Vitality
Song of Earth
Song of Warding
(songs subject to change depending on sws level and party setup)
Malaria 4
Chant of Victory
Clarity


Advanced block
Bless shield.

I put the last 2 below because i will not always have these.

Now, these are pretty standard buffs at high end game pvp, which you dont take part in. I could throw Valor on there if i really wanted to, but i wont.

GL landing your hex through my 1910 m.def

Enjoy.

Oh, and btw, i didnt take into account the "equivelent buffs that you had" thing and then completely disregarded it because it doesnt mean [censored].

[Armenua]

[ QUOTE ]
riky and fs r such trolls even spamming here

Edited by Moderator4 (03/01/08 09:05 PM)

[/ QUOTE ]
Blauw ... #5 edit!!! you are out of control!!!!!

[styx]

Yes the A/S stats and buffs that I chose to use as a reference is even a little high,for our audiance, than I wanted to use but I found it to suffice. Now your making an arguement based on situations that theretically shouldn't happen in the first place. I hope that a B or A grade BD doesn't try and root a fully buff'd S grade SE o0. Why they would try and root an SE in the first place is beyond me(PvP against an SE is laughable anyhow?). Posting with high S grade buffs at an obvious PvP situation where no one should be any lower than 76+ with the same buffs would, as I mentioned, make you look stupid.
The Men reminder is appreciated though and I understand now that using a Mage class in this analysis was a mistake. I can retrack my statment that Hex lands 90% and substitute that it lands 90% of the time on Melee classes, as per my experience. Everyone knows that winning against a Mage is not about root per se. It's about getting in close and using fast atks/polearm(u mages always cry when pole is used) to cancel buffs/magic attacks).
Now fully buffed S grade BD stats are as follows:
HP 6830 CP 2673
MP 2632
P.Atk. 1496 M.Atk. 376
P.Def. 1103 M.Def. 928
Accuracy 118 Evasion 113
Critical 116 Speed 177
Atk. Spd. 721 Casting Spd. 317
Now I'm not saying that this is enough to 1v1 a nuker class(especially since they would run for sure once UD was executed). But let me say this. Primarily this situation would never happen with a skilled BD player. In Mass PvP this would be well enough to contribute effective damage on any class. Remember L2 is all about War not 1v1?
Note** Your not taking into consideration that there are PvP vid's out there of Mage classes getting completely Pwn'd by (yes you guessed it - BD)

[Ramaya]

First off, that was of my EE.

Not really a nuker class.

You want my sps stats here they are.

Lvl 77 SPS

HP 6935 CP 1598
MP 3879
P.Atk. 430 M.Atk. 2514
P.Def. 1139 M.Def. 1569
Accuracy 115 Evasion 94
Critical 49 Speed 149
Atk. Spd. 510 Casting Spd. 1907


And btw, your not going to land 90% against a melee class either. Sorry. Here are the stats for lets say a TH lvl 77.

77 TH.

P 9696 CP 1788
MP 2474
P.Atk. 787 M.Atk. 312
P.Def. 1643 M.Def. 1649
Accuracy 116 Evasion 130
Critical 400 Speed 149
Atk. Spd. 1118 Casting Spd. 296

AS with haste SA, +3 tat jewels bd/sws buffs

Gl landing your fully buffed 376 m.atk hex on a melee class with 1649 m.def

Stop with the stupidity now.

[styx]

The BD stats that I've put up there HAVE NO MATK BUFFS.
Stop being an idiot.

[Armenua]

Rikky! Be nice!!!

[styx]

Here [censored] hole.
HP 5997 CP 2056
MP 2217
P.Atk. 2316 M.Atk. 790
P.Def. 1103 M.Def. 928
Accuracy 115 Evasion 113
Critical 262 Speed 177
Atk. Spd. 650 Casting Spd. 317
with spirit shots your **** right im landing 90% on a TH.GUARANTEED.
You guys have played this game so long with your heads up your *** for so long that your impervious to different methodologies that ppl may try or believe has a substantial edge on the norm.
Get a life.

[Blauw]

this thread is epic

[Ramaya]

Know what? I think ill make some screenshot tests.

[Blauw]

so u only take shots of failed attempts?

[DevilStar]

[ QUOTE ]
Know what? I think ill make some screenshot tests.

[/ QUOTE ]

when I'm bored at some point I'll log in a 78 spectral Dancer vs my 78 Sagi and fraps a bunch of tries.