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Old 07-26-2012, 06:34 PM   #21
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juji View Post
I'm afraid that SoulMagicX is correct. This test was too small to give an accurate enchant rate for weapons and armor.
But you can still apply statistical approaches to calculate an accurate enchant rate, by setting a standard mean study (the famous gaussian distribution N(U,O) that can be analyzed with stat-inference) and establish rates that will not be that far from the current setup of the server (as long as you did more than 30 tries, you can deduct it by the principle of "central limit theoretics").
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:49 PM   #22
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Osito2Dancer View Post
But you can still apply statistical approaches to calculate an accurate enchant rate, by setting a standard mean study (the famous gaussian distribution N(U,O) that can be analyzed with stat-inference) and establish rates that will not be that far from the current setup of the server (as long as you did more than 30 tries, you can deduct it by the principle of "central limit theoretics").
I already posted the enchant rates in the Lab Requests topic. 1/3 for Armor and 2/3 for Weapons.
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Old 07-28-2012, 12:04 AM   #23
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Juji View Post
I already posted the enchant rates in the Lab Requests topic. 1/3 for Armor and 2/3 for Weapons.
Still, your tests indicate that the armor chance is larger than 1/3 success rate (is rather 1/3 of failure as it seems). Weapons seem to be deviated from the 2/3 though, but its expectable. Also, you didnt try with magic weapons and fighter weapons, since they do have different enchant chances (or so i've "heard" ).

But i digress; to establish a numerical value on the chance of getting your +6 armor +15 weapon is being mean to those who find "enjoyable" to do over-enchanting (such as myself), one of the most fun aspects of the game is to break an important weapon at +4 and get a +15 D grade weapon meant to be Crystal Supply.
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Old 07-28-2012, 08:40 PM   #24
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Osito2Dancer View Post
Still, your tests indicate that the armor chance is larger than 1/3 success rate (is rather 1/3 of failure as it seems). Weapons seem to be deviated from the 2/3 though, but its expectable. Also, you didnt try with magic weapons and fighter weapons, since they do have different enchant chances (or so i've "heard" ).

But i digress; to establish a numerical value on the chance of getting your +6 armor +15 weapon is being mean to those who find "enjoyable" to do over-enchanting (such as myself), one of the most fun aspects of the game is to break an important weapon at +4 and get a +15 D grade weapon meant to be Crystal Supply.
From what i've tested (and i tested a lot) there's a different rate in armor enchant from +3 to +4 (i'm guessing it's 2/3) the rest is in line to what Juji said. (2/3 to weapon, 1/3 to armor higher then +4)
Why Juji still says the rate from +3 to +4 is 1/3, even after he kinda disproved in this topic it's a mystery to me. (Sorry Juji )
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Old 07-30-2012, 03:18 AM   #25
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

ChildofHeaven (GM at the Asia) made a test that showed a way lower OE rate. Especially once you OE the Armor +4 -> +5 and +5 -> +6.
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Old 07-30-2012, 09:21 AM   #26
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

About halfway down here you will find the test:
http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/l2_friend...8587&l=f&fid=5
一般狀況 means enchanting a Bound Apokalypse Cutter from +3 to +4 without Lucky Stone 200 times, success rate 50。5%.
輔助石 means enchanting a Bound Apokalypse Cutter from +3 to +4 with Lucky Stone 200 times, success rate 56。5%
Juji doesn't say what is written in the description of the Lucky Stones he used. Child of Heaven used Event Stones/武器用強化輔助石-R級(活動) which improve the chance by 10%. In Korea there are also Stones which improve the chance by 20%:
http://nshop.plaync.co.kr/lineage2/g...sortOrder=DESC

And that's where it gets tricky. Those 10% resp 20% are taken from the base probability of an unaided enchantment attempt. R-Grade physical weapons have a base probability of 50%. Add to that 10% of 50%, i.e. 50+5, and you are at ChildOfHeaven's result. Armor, on the other hand, has a much lower probability when you go beyond +4:
http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/l2_friend...6405&l=f&fid=5
So enchanting a Twilight Breastplate only to +4 is a bit misleading. Since the base probability of going from +4 to +5 is only 33%, 10% of that added would only give you 36%

By the way, there seem to be people around who seriously believe that mage weapons have the same enchantment success rate as physical weapons. If Juji could add a test with a magical weapon (Apocalypse Buster or whatever) this might help to avoid a lot of frustration among new players
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:48 PM   #27
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Juji View Post
AHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA
God, how ppl can be as stupid.
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Old 09-08-2012, 09:29 AM   #28
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

this is synthethic test or what? how it posible that suces with weapon is 50%? i make 8 fail to enhcnat apo dual dagers to +4... 8 times.... and i know ppl who make 18 fails to make +4!! 18 times!! what is going here?
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Old 09-08-2012, 09:37 AM   #29
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Cegua View Post
this is synthethic test or what? how it posible that suces with weapon is 50%? i make 8 fail to enhcnat apo dual dagers to +4... 8 times.... and i know ppl who make 18 fails to make +4!! 18 times!! what is going here?
Bad luck ?

Attribute stone success rate was 50% during Gracia Final. A lot of tests proved it, and some illegal and stolen server files showed it also. But I was able to fail 10 stones in a row, then success 10 stones in a row.
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Old 11-21-2012, 05:26 AM   #30
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by AzMoDaN View Post
Is chance for mages weapons (apocalypse buster/caster) the same or not? I've heard it's lower…
I would like to know this myself...any chance of a test?
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Old 11-21-2012, 10:23 AM   #31
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Punky View Post
I would like to know this myself...any chance of a test?
+1 I would love to see some tests on mage weapons as well to satisfy my curiosity a bit.
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Old 01-22-2013, 01:56 PM   #32
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juji View Post
I already posted the enchant rates in the Lab Requests topic. 1/3 for Armor and 2/3 for Weapons.
Now that this myth created by juji was "destroyed" by the euro version of this lab test, (Would like to know why they let them test enchant rates but not here) can we at least get an apologie for misleading us into believe in false rates?
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:08 PM   #33
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by BurnCycle View Post
Now that this myth created by juji was "destroyed" by the euro version of this lab test, (Would like to know why they let them test enchant rates but not here) can we at least get an apologie for misleading us into believe in false rates?
What myth? You still have a 2/3 chance at each enchant stage to get a successful enchant. So if you're going from +3 to +4 it should be 2/3 then for +3 to +5 it is 2/3 * 2/3. As you go higher it gets harder. The enchant rate for magic weapons is much lower than 2/3, but I don't have the exact number for that one.

If you wanted to do a REAL test for specific enchant probabilities for each level then you would have to enchant 10,000 weapons or higher. Anything lower will not yield the exact probabilities. This is the reason why I never bothered with completing that request.
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Last edited by Juji; 01-22-2013 at 05:27 PM.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:30 PM   #34
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juji View Post
What myth? You still have a 2/3 chance at each enchant stage to get a successful enchant. So if you're going from +3 to +4 it should be 2/3 then for +3 to +5 it is 2/3 * 2/3. As you go higher it gets harder. The enchant rate for magic weapons is much lower than 2/3, but I don't have the exact number for that one.

If you wanted to do a REAL test for specific enchant probabilities for each level then you would have to enchant 10,000 weapons or higher. Anything lower will not yield the exact probabilities. This is the reason why I never bothered with completing that request.
https://forum.4game.com/showthread.php?t=14278

1000 weapons got OE'd : 1000 bow, 1000 retributer
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:38 PM   #35
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laby View Post
https://forum.4game.com/showthread.php?t=14278

1000 weapons got OE'd : 1000 bow, 1000 retributer
Again, 1,000 weapons is not enough for an accurate test. The enchant rate is the chance you have to get a successful enchant at each level and this does not change. What does change is the probability from going to different enchant levels.

For Example:
+3 to +4 is 2/3
+3 to +5 is 2/3 * 2/3
+3 to +6 is 2/3 * 2/3 * 2/3
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:40 PM   #36
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by MichalisKrdm View Post
I don't really believe in Lucky Enchant Stones, not from the view that they don't work but from the view that they do not increase your luck. If karma doesn't want you to enchant something, you won't.
I made my Dual Blunts +7 without any Destruction/Blessed Scroll or Lucky Stone because of that reason.

@Juji Also, you should add a Like or Thumb up button here hahaha.
http://i.qkme.me/35f2uw.jpg
sure. but when *I* do it, its trolling.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:40 PM   #37
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

I don't know if you took some time to read the link in fact There are numbers for going from +3 to +4, then +3 to +5, +3 to +6 & so, exactly as you show your math.

But the numbers are far from this value.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:50 PM   #38
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

He probably didnt read at all. (Juji, doesn't look like you )
The funny thing is that Juji own tests supported the results on this lab made by Innova ppl. He just keep saying the % was the same.
We now know that the % of going from +19 to +20 is 20% chance in weapons. (20% is a bit diferent from 2/3... maybe i don't know math at all)
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:52 PM   #39
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laby View Post
I don't know if you took some time to read the link in fact There are numbers for going from +3 to +4, then +3 to +5, +3 to +6 & so, exactly as you show your math.

But the numbers are far from this value.
I did read it and the numbers are far from the value I gave because the number of weapons enchanted in that test is not enough to give accurate data. If I were to enchant over 10,000 weapons then the number I would get for +3 to +4 would be around 66%.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:54 PM   #40
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Default Re: Lab Test 22 - Lucky Enchant Stones

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Originally Posted by Juji View Post
I did read it and the numbers are far from the value I gave because the number of weapons enchanted in that test is not enough to give accurate data. If I were to enchant over 10,000 weapons then the number I would get for +3 to +4 would be around 66%.
Quote:
I also put the data in a table:


Enchantment Chance
+3 - +4 52,5%
+3 -+5 26,6%
+3 - +6 14,5%
+3 - +7 4,6%
+3 - +8 1,5%
+3 - +9 0,4%
+3 - +10 0,2%

And here is the success rate for each enchantment stage:

Stage Chance
+3 - +4 52,5%
+4 - +5 50,7%
+5 - +6 54,5%
+6 - +7 31,7%
+7 - +8 32,6%
+8 - +9 26,7%
+9 - +10 50%
2/3 is NOT 52%. I would advise you to check your math.

Edit: A real 2/3 chance is more in this test:
https://forum.4game.com/showthread.php?t=14437

With your theory this is an aberration:
https://forum.4game.com/showthread.php?t=13922

Honestly i dont understand why you keep insisting in something that simply is not truth.

Last edited by BurnCycle; 01-22-2013 at 05:57 PM.
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