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Old 07-17-2017, 08:39 PM   #1
No bad
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Default R R95 R99 same M attack

Question All Grade weapons have saying magic attack will the damage to mobs be the same i e R Grade weapon ++++ vs R 99 + both with same M attack
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Old 07-22-2017, 12:11 AM   #2
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by No bad View Post
Question All Grade weapons have saying magic attack will the damage to mobs be the same i e R Grade weapon ++++ vs R 99 + both with same M attack
Actually no. If you took a +12 Blessed Apoc Retributer and put it against a +5 or 6, whatever matches the same Mattack (I have no idea what +) actually the higher enchanted of the 2 will make more damage because of SS bonus. This works until you either raise the mattack of the higher grade one or make it blessed/bloody/dark. The only reason I say dark it because it increases mattack just like blessing it would.
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Old 07-22-2017, 01:08 AM   #3
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Post Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by No bad View Post
Question All Grade weapons have saying magic attack will the damage to mobs be the same i e R Grade weapon ++++ vs R 99 + both with same M attack
I just pulled some stats off AH looking for similar Matk:
+0 R99 standard Buster/Caster 371 Matk 0% shot bonus
+5 R95 standard Buster/Caster 374 Matk 3.5% shot bonus
----If you had Sapphire Lv 2(3.5% SpS bonus) equipped for R99----
----unequipped for R95 they should do nearly identical damage----
----If the weapons had identical SAs & Element ----

+6 Blessed Apocalypse Buster/Caster 373 Matk 4.2% shot bonus
+10 Blessed Apocalypse Cutter/Avenger/Shaper 370 Matk 7.0% shot bonus
----as above the +10 Blessed Apoc 1-h fighter weapon w/o sapphire----
----and +5 standard R95 with Sapphire Lv 2. ----

Last edited by R48817; 07-22-2017 at 01:24 AM.
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Old 07-26-2017, 12:49 AM   #4
AnotherSorc
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Same MATK = Same DMG, grade (R, R95, R99) does not matter. R99 ofc does have the Bloody/Dark option, but if you ignore this, you simply have to look on the MATK of the weapon to know which does the highest damage.

Here's some additional info for you:

Standard/Blessed/Dark or Bloody
Blessed = increases base MATK on weapon, almost doubles the bonus you received from overenchanting
Dark/Bloody = increases base MATK on weapon a bit more than Blessed, same (almost double) bonus from overenchanting as on Blessed.

Bonus for +4 Weapons (this bonus is for +4 and does not further increase)
Buster: +1mcrit +1maccuracy
Caster: +381 mcitDmg
Retributer: +matk 44 +mcritDmg 381 +castspd 1%

Bonus for OEed Weapons
Shotbonus 0,7% for each OE, starting at +1.
So a +10 Weapon will have 7% shotbonus, a +20 Weapon will have 14%.

High OEed Mage Weapons from +16
Retributer will have slightly more MATK compared to any 1hand + Sigil. On +16 that changes and the 1h + Sigil will have slightly more MATK compared to retributer.

OE enchant bonus or each enchant lvl
BLESS/DARK/BLOODY // STANDARD
1-3 = +8 M.Atk // +5 M.Atk)
4-6 = +16 M.Atk // +10 M.Atk)
7-9 = +24 M.Atk // +15 M.Atk)
10-12 = +32 M.Atk // +20 M.Atk)
13 and higher = +40 M.Atk) / / +25 M.Atk)

MATK compared for 1h Caster
DARK/BLOODY AMARANTHINE CASTER
+0 = 417 MATK base
+12 = 657 MATK + OE shotdmg = 8,40 %
+16 = 817 MATK + OE shotdmg = 11,20 %
+18 = 897 MATK + OE shotdmg = 12,60 %

BLESSED SPECTER CASTER
+0 = 349 MATK base
+12 = 589 MATK + OE shotdmg = 8,40 %
+16 = 749 MATK + OE shotdmg = 11,20 %
+18 = 829 MATK + OE shotdmg = 12,60 %
+20 = 909 MATK + OE shotdmg = 14,00 %

BLESSED APOCALYPSE CASTER
+0 = 301 MATK base
+12 = 541 MATK + OE shotdmg = 8,40 %
+16 = 701 MATK + OE shotdmg = 11,20 %
+18 = 781 MATK + OE shotdmg = 12,60 %
+20 = 861 MATK + OE shotdmg = 14,00 %

Last edited by AnotherSorc; 07-27-2017 at 12:39 AM.
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Old 07-27-2017, 07:03 AM   #5
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Hi there.


I am a Feoh 103, with normal gear. Just did a Test on PVE and PVP.
My main weapon is a +14 Bloody Buster ( 737 M attack ) [ 15% M Critical Damage Augment ] , and the other weapon I did the Test was a +20 Apo Caster ( 861 M Attack ) [ No Augment].


It seems that with the Bloody Buster I was doing 200-400 more Damage to mobs and at least 7K more Critical Damage. Same results for pvp also on same char.


Mobs I tested was in EV and char was an ISS.


So even if the Apocalypse weapon had an Augment , I assume the Damage would be exactly the same.


I guess there are many factors to consider for Damage apart from the Magic attack of the weapon. [ Korean Random ]
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Old 07-27-2017, 07:44 AM   #6
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kost4s View Post
Hi there.


I am a Feoh 103, with normal gear. Just did a Test on PVE and PVP.
My main weapon is a +14 Bloody Buster ( 737 M attack ) [ 15% M Critical Damage Augment ] , and the other weapon I did the Test was a +20 Apo Caster ( 861 M Attack ) [ No Augment].


It seems that with the Bloody Buster I was doing 200-400 more Damage to mobs and at least 7K more Critical Damage. Same results for pvp also on same char.


Mobs I tested was in EV and char was an ISS.


So even if the Apocalypse weapon had an Augment , I assume the Damage would be exactly the same.


I guess there are many factors to consider for Damage apart from the Magic attack of the weapon. [ Korean Random ]
So, you are saying that the Bloody Weap with lower MATK did more DMG in PVP compared to the Apo with higher MATK ? Cos that shouldnt be possible.

- What SAs were on those weapons?
- How many nukes with each weapon did u do? You used only one nuke (without debuff) and you figured in possible dmg-variations done by Masters Rage? The incredible wide dmg-variable we have makes it hard to get good results.

Your PVE result ofc sounds reasonable due to the bloody/augment bonus.
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Old 07-27-2017, 08:09 AM   #7
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Isn't there a built in mechanic that involves some correlation between the targets lvl compared to the grade of the weapon?

Say at 103, fighting 103 mobs, an R99 with "x" dmg would do more than the R with "x" dmg.
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Old 07-27-2017, 09:25 AM   #8
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Hi again.


The difference on pvp was 200- 400 more with the Bloody weapon.


> Both weapons had same SA's ( Bloody had lvl 6 crystals, Apo had lvl 5)
> I tried only 1 skill with No debuffs for both pve and pvp.


I want to mention though that Bloody weapon has Wind Attribute , but the Apocalypse had Holy ( As Feoh's don't have Holy attribute )


I did another Test also , with a +20 Apocalypse Retributer ( Same SA's as Bloody and Wind Attribute ) (M attack = Around 930 ) . This weapon was dealing 5-10% more Damage than my Bloody on Both PVP and PVE.


As Chucksteak mentioned , the game Probably has a built in mechanic which takes into account the Target lvl and weapon lvl. ( We can't be 100% as NC never confirmed )


On a Side note , my Magic attack was more with the +20 Caster due to Sigil bonus, but probably due to the attribute the Damage was Higher with the Retri.
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Old 07-27-2017, 10:03 AM   #9
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Appreciate your efforts, thanks Kost4s!

But to get real numbers, you must pay more attention when testing.
The Apo on first try had holy attribute that you cannot use as Stormscreamer (guess you are STS?). 300 Attribute missing is around/up to 25% damage difference alone from that, so your first results are misleading and obsolete.

The new test results with the Apo Retri are also weird:
+20 Apo Retri dealing 5 to 10% more PVP damage compared to +14 Bloody sounds bit low, but still alright. But in PVE there MUST be a difference in results as the Bloody does have the 15% bonus ofc, so it cannot give the same result as your PVP test. Something must be wrong again.

It would be cool if you can repeat your test with +20 Apo Retri and +14 Bloody, both same Attribute, same SAs. Ignore criticals as the 15% crit augment on the Bloody weap will distort your results, just compare standard hits.

Test:
Nuke 200 times (or even better 500 times) on the same Mob with both weapons, write down all damage and calculate average damage per hit (total dmg ./. number of nukes = average damage).
-> ignore all hits you do with "Masters Rage" trigger on ( if you have it ).
-> Watch your buffs to not run out of sonatas while testing.
When done, repeat this test in PVP (take a healer so the target PC doesnt die all time), care for the buffs on your target (sonatas etc.) to be same all the time while u nuke it.

This will give you a real damage comparsion between those two weapons.


PS:
Oh, and about the "weapon grade against level of user"-penalty. No worries, this does not exist
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Old 07-27-2017, 11:36 AM   #10
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Default Re: R R95 R99 same M attack

Well I am afraid that i lost my chance to do this test now, as both weapons was a friends, and he now sold them. ( Lucky him )

To be fair i did both test in order to figure out if i should sell my bloody weapon and get one of those, but at the end I preferred my Bloody with the Prospect to make it +15 in the future .

If I get my hands in any other OE weapon i will do a more accurate Test.
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