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Old 07-26-2010, 08:14 AM   #21
Ferine
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Default Re: Enchant results.

Ok I got to 82 now so it was time for +15....

Seal of Silence +15 chance
Seal of Binding +15 chance
Steal Essence +15 cost
Soul Cry/Guard staying at +10 until I get bored in the future, same with my (lol) heavy mastery +10 for p.def (+20 freaking p.def is all!)

Dreaming spirit, Seal of winter, Seal of Suspension, Fear all blew going for +15 from +10 so I'll have to wait till I can afford some GBs to enchant those.

My plan is to use regular GCs to get all my skills +15 then when I'm 83 go to +18 on 3 key skills (maybe sleep, fear, suspension still gotta decide).

at 84 I'll start using mastery books to get those skills to +21, then +30 at 85.

76 skills I'll try for +6 on the important ones now (CoV/Despare) then maybe +8 at 83 and +10 at 84 before using masteries to +15 at 85. Those skills don't seem to be as hard to enchant as the pre-76 ones, lots less chance to fail.

Hell, if I'm bored and got enough money/sp I might even get all my buffs/heals to +10 too just for a sense of achievement, lol.



Edit: Just to add info on results.

Silence seemed to land maybe 30% on a group of 80+ toons in arena, about the same on my 80 SE with mental shield 990 m.def.

Root landed a lot more often but I do have the oly ring for +30% root chance.

Steal essence now costs 141mp base, a total of -36 mp from original. I think I'll stick with cost especially for fights versus classes such as tanks who can UD through enlightenment.

Last edited by Ferine; 07-26-2010 at 08:19 AM.
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Old 07-26-2010, 08:35 AM   #22
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Default Re: Enchant results.

QQ +15>< jealousssss

I have like 500mil sp atm just no adena which i can spare too enchant. Also im hoping to ding this week 4% to go and then my chances will prob a bit higher.

Do u notice that root silence lands better compared too +10 or is the change so minsicule that welll Oeing more for the fun then effectiveness?

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Old 07-26-2010, 10:32 AM   #23
Ferine
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Default Re: Enchant results.

Didn't really test enough to be able to tell you properly sorry mate. Only skill I really tried on was my +10 dreaming spirit (which sucked), the silence binding and drain weren't out of preference, they were just the ones that didn't blow, lol. Binding I might use in oly, but I wouldn't rely on silence in there.
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Old 07-27-2010, 10:55 AM   #24
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Default Re: Enchant results.

ok +15 fear (made some cash so got 4 books)......

landed 4/50 on lvl 80 se 1110 m.def, mental shield. (8% landrate)

+15 binding landed 16/50 on same SE. (32% landrate)

considering fear is a single target skill so assume 80% base land compared to 40% base land on root that'd imply that my +30% root chance oly ring made a massive difference.



WTB Zaken (again). QQ
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Old 07-27-2010, 04:26 PM   #25
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Default Re: Enchant results.

here i blew up dreaming spirit 9-10 was only a 74% chance, but i wanted it to succeed, but knew it would fail. it was 7, succeeded +8, then +9, but blew at +10, i hate when that happens.
meanwhile, pve land rate is like 90% on all them skills.
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Old 07-28-2010, 12:23 PM   #26
Benzine
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Default Re: Enchant results.

As for useful seals, which would those be?

I have an OL alt and I'm not bothering to clutter her Skill list with junk like Shaman skills or buffs I get combo's for later. I'd like to add waste-of-mp seals to that "no thanks" list. =)
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:14 PM   #27
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Default Re: Enchant results.

well...
the SP you save from not getting skills is not worth not getting the skills.
however.
there are a lot of skills you won't use on a normal basis.

Seal of Gloom/Aura burn, they are mana drain over times.
the drain isn't very high, although if you magic crit, you do instant mana drain combined with the over time.
same with Seal of Poison, not worth getting, slow cast, low dps.


depending on how you are leveling...
Seal of Chaos may nor be useful.
it cast like Seal of Winter, but is reduce accuracy, i don't know how effective it is, but it's not used too often.

Seal of Suspension is mostly pvp, however it lasts 2 minutes if it lands, so it can also be good for raids if it lands(rare depending on level/M.attack)
Same can be said for Seal of Scurge, good for Raids primarily.


Seal of Binding, Seal of Winter, Seal of Silence are most common used pre-76.
post 76, Disease is primarily for OLY and PVP... weird land rate, ranged aoe, and not as powerful as Limit by a long shot.

Seal of Despair is a good one, Blockade is more situational.

does that cover them all?
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Old 07-28-2010, 08:04 PM   #28
Benzine
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Default Re: Enchant results.

You didn't mention Seal of Slow?

I won't need any for leveling, I have prophecy, BD, and a dagger.

It isn't about SP, it's about skill list clutter. I like to do that on any character, like not learning "confusion" on a BD, etc.

Oh and to contribute I guess:

DiegoVargas

"Funny reading peoples opinions on when they should stop OE'ing.

At level 85 OE >= +28 is 36% or less. That is the GOOD rate, the same OE at 84 is 4%.

Basically here is the deal.

You can realistically +9 2nd job skills at 78.
Dont go for more then +1 on 3rd job until you are 81.

I would not go higher then +9 until you are 82+, at that point use regular codex books until you hit +13. Every OE after 13 should use a mastery book since cost/odds work out more favorably that way.

Getting +20 or higher oe's is easily a 350-600m investment per skill, but it is a pretty big deal for high end pvp and pve."

Last edited by Benzine; 07-28-2010 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 07-29-2010, 12:11 AM   #29
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Default Re: Enchant results.

thats some interesting advice.
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Old 08-06-2010, 06:01 AM   #30
Ferine
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Default Re: Enchant results.

I've found +15 at 82 takes roughly 10-13 tries, so not a bad investment considering then you're all set for enchanting skills to +18 with mastery codexes when you're 83+ and it'd be 900mil+ for the protection of rune/element/allignment skill scrolls.

The way I see it 70% (69% for +15 at 82+) is a decent success rate. So +15 is more worth the SP/Adena investment before spamming mastery codexes. Maybe I'm too used to 60% crafting? I've not done the maths to work out the break point, but each blessed enchant costs the same as 10 normal enchants in adena/sp costs alone, so I don't see the point in using mastery before +15, especially with normal books costing 4.2mil now and buyshopping for 3.1mil. If what's happened on other freya servers follows suit mastery codexes are gonna plummet in price too with the decline of KE costs. So using mastery books would be unwise now when you can sell high now and wait 30 days for them to be cheaper or easier to farm.

Now I've got:

Fear, Dreaming Spirit, Seal of Suspensioin, Seal of Silence, Seal of Binding +15 Chance.

Steal essence +15 cost.

Soul Guard, Soul Cry, Toughness +10 power.

Heavy armor mastery +10 p.def.

Seal of Dispare +3 chance.

Victories +3 reduce penalty.

Divine lore +3 power.

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Enchant Viability


IMO debuff skills that rely on landrate are well worth OEing so they land, passives aren't really worth OEing unless you either want to test (like me) or want consistency. Toughness seems worth it although it only adds 4 resist for 10 enchants, soul guard/cry don't seem much worth it past +10, +20 would only add 40.6 more p.def and 30 more p.atk than +10 and cost a bomb more.... if you really want it +4 on your armor would possibly be cheaper, or an augment, lol. +3 Divine lore now gives 6% clarity, which is nice, but not really worth OEing higher since the boost seems only very small from now on.

Heavy mastery was a complete waste +10 gives 20 more p.def, +12 attack gives +1 attack speed, +12 cast gives 1 casting speed. Similar "boosts" with light, robe and magic resistance masteries, faster casting and boost mp regen/mana. Although I'd like to think OEing m.def passives increases the resist rate although I doubt it does. Plus the fact passives cost a TON in SP/Adena to enchant.



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Steal Essence


I did some tests on power vs cost for steal essence on pts also which I'll copy from the other thread where I wrote it up.

+15 cost reduced the cost of the nuke by 36 making it 141 mp rather than 177, power didn't make every individual nuke more powerful, but increased the amount of damage variance and generally made the high damage higher and the lower damage lower, often though the damage was the same per individual nuke but over time it does add up. I did 40 nukes with steal essense enchanted for +15 power and 40 nukes with steal essense +15 cost with a +5 Vesper Caster, then the same with a low D grade mace. No tats, Elega robe set, basic Domi buffs and giran NPC as a target.

Damage wise per nuke

Power worked out as:

Max 3466 / 525
Min 2473 / 444
Avg 3025 / 474


Cost:

Max 3245 / 486
Min 2198 / 408
Avg 2737 / 448


So power generally does a bit more damage, but over time you could do 20 power nukes for the same MP cost as 24 cost nukes meaning you do more damage overall with cost.

The thing is though that magic crits were about 2k more damage with power than cost (avg mrit for 10k power, 7.9k cost), but that's on an NPC with high damage so take a third off for the 2x damage in pvp and divide by three to get to more realistic base damage (1k vs a pc rather than 3k vs npc) and you get to rougly 400 more damage a crit in pvp.

So I'd say power would be nice with a setup aimed at enlightenment and magic critting in oly, but vs classes such as tanks with loads of HP and UDs you mught struggle unless you use melee and drain less. This also doesn't take into account low levels of enchant such as +6-+10. Also if you have to change route to get to power from cost you stand the risk of losing +1/+2 from your enchant level so theres gonna be costs involved in getting back to where you were.


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Extra bits.

One thing that seems to be more influential on skill landing than enchants is epics (and level, but you can't buy that ). But at 1.2bil a jewel or a ton of oly tokens for a shadow one it's probably cheaper to get your stuff to +15 rather than hold out for epics, unless you can get em through clan or whatever. Say +15 costs 60mil at 82 buying 15 codexes at 3.2mil each and the cost in adena to enchant (you could have your own codexes you've farmed, but they're still worth market value), that's 600mil for 10 OE'd seals. Half the cost of an epic which will increase the landrate to maybe 3 of those skills and give less m.def than s80 jewels. Although the defense is definately worth having and I'm looking at getting epics, just not right now. Plus once your stuff is OE'd you can get epics also to make it land even more.

Personally my plans are to get seal of winter to +15 as my last OE'd debuff, then at 83+ get my lvl 76+ skills to +6 and slowly go higher and higher with dreaming spirit, seal of suspension and fear to get them to +25 at least for oly. All dependant on how much money I have and how many spare books. Whilst Morai sets are still coming out so theres no point investing in dynasty and even then I'd take vesper over morai any day for stun resist (I'm pretty sure it gets stun resist right?). I've not got much to spend money on so enchants are a nice low-cost sideline till I can aim for the bigger stuff such as armor.

Last edited by Ferine; 08-06-2010 at 06:34 AM.
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Old 08-11-2010, 12:21 AM   #31
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Default Re: Enchant results.

not worth enchanting devine lore past +1 until you're 83.
it's sad, but it just doesn't increase at a good rate.

+1 = 6%, next % doesn't happen until after +4... it's a little broken.
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