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Old 01-18-2017, 05:16 PM   #1
D3VASTATlON
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Default What would have higher dps?

Assuming all gear is equal with the summoner having 1500 Atk speed and 500 Crit rate and only factoring auto hits from Summons, which class would have higher dps at lvl 100, the EM because of the Crit damage or the AL because of Atk speed? Why? Do things change with the 101 buffs?
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Old 01-19-2017, 02:23 AM   #2
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by D3VASTATlON View Post
Assuming all gear is equal with the summoner having 1500 Atk speed and 500 Crit rate and only factoring auto hits from Summons, which class would have higher dps at lvl 100, the EM because of the Crit damage or the AL because of Atk speed? Why? Do things change with the 101 buffs?
I've always been told that Critical Damage > All. The 15% attack speed added on top of summons attacks IMO is negligible. Adding 15% critical damage on top of 100k hits, not so negligible.

Similar question from me though, 15% pattack from DE wynn vs 15% critical damage from LE Wynn? Does 15% pattack = 15% damage base and on a critical hit as well? If so Pattack > C. Damage > Att. Speed
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Old 01-19-2017, 04:33 PM   #3
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

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Originally Posted by KissThis View Post
I've always been told that Critical Damage > All. The 15% attack speed added on top of summons attacks IMO is negligible. Adding 15% critical damage on top of 100k hits, not so negligible.

Similar question from me though, 15% pattack from DE wynn vs 15% critical damage from LE Wynn? Does 15% pattack = 15% damage base and on a critical hit as well? If so Pattack > C. Damage > Att. Speed
Hello

I would just like to appending: Im DeLf summoner(lvl102) and summons buff +27% pattak only the basis pet pattak affect.
Nevermind its on Transform or how many pattak transfer to summon.
+27% always on basis pattak raise.

if by delf work this maybe EM buff +20% crit dmg its fix dmg work same as "critical dmg hat"( thats only theory) but if fix and not stack with pom sos
somebody can check this ?
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Old 01-19-2017, 05:24 PM   #4
Aranel
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by D3VASTATlON View Post
Assuming all gear is equal with the summoner having 1500 Atk speed and 500 Crit rate and only factoring auto hits from Summons, which class would have higher dps at lvl 100, the EM because of the Crit damage or the AL because of Atk speed? Why? Do things change with the 101 buffs?
The best dps summoner is elemental master bcs he have doble decrese pdef/mdef debuff, from yellow mark -30% pdef/mdef and freezing invoke (4 rune stone skill) -30% pdef/mdef, only for this elemental is the king of dps if we are talking about pets* dps.
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Old 01-20-2017, 08:02 PM   #5
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by D3VASTATlON View Post
Assuming all gear is equal with the summoner having 1500 Atk speed and 500 Crit rate and only factoring auto hits from Summons, which class would have higher dps at lvl 100, the EM because of the Crit damage or the AL because of Atk speed? Why? Do things change with the 101 buffs?
It is a tough question, many things to take into account.
Elf > The power of nature is used to increase P. Atk./P. Def./M. Atk./M. Def. by 20% for 30 seconds. Additionally, P. Atk. +20%, Atk. Spd. +10%, and Skill Cooldown -60% for servitors.
Dark elf > The power of demons is used to increase P. Atk./P. Def./M. Atk./M. Def. by 20% for 30 seconds. Additionally, P. Atk. +20% and P. Critical Damage +20% for servitors. The Servitor also becomes immune to debuffs. 10 Spirit Ore consumed.

This is wynn's 101 skills, as you can see dark elf beats them by far (20%! more DPS because it has both P. Atk AND Critical damage)

However, as i explain below 20% critical damage from elf buff have ~5% more DPS than the 20% P. Atk the Dark elf buff.
So if its a battle between lv. 100s, elf win. At lv. 101, dark elf win.

But it gets more complicated as at end game you need to transform yourself (and while transformed you are not allowed to use these 101 skills, but you can use the skill and then transform..)
So for 30 seconds (buff duration) dark elf will have ~20% more DPS than elf cause of this buff, after 30 seconds elf will have 5% more than dark elf.

I would say for the first ~7 minutes of being transformed hitting the same target.. lv. 101 dark elf will win the damage battle.
Once it passes ~7 minute the elf will have more damage.

So to summarize..
At lv. 100, elf will win.
At lv. 101, Dark elf will win if you kill the raid in under 7 minutes, after that, elf will win. (Which should only be dragons pretty much, maybe some lv. 100+ raids if you have low DPS)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KissThis View Post
I've always been told that Critical Damage > All. The 15% attack speed added on top of summons attacks IMO is negligible. Adding 15% critical damage on top of 100k hits, not so negligible.

Similar question from me though, 15% pattack from DE wynn vs 15% critical damage from LE Wynn? Does 15% pattack = 15% damage base and on a critical hit as well? If so Pattack > C. Damage > Att. Speed
10% increase of P. Atk ON STATS will increase damage by 10% (critical hits included), however because of how buffs work etc etc, a 10% increase will never be 10%, but more like ~7.5% (Check this with BR, you will not get double P. Atk).

As such, giving your pets 20% more P. Atk will give ~15% more P. Atk on stats resulting in 15% more damage.
It does not get double (as you seem to think) when you make a critical hit, so 15% increase of P. Atk is the same as increasing 15% critical damage, only difference is your normal hits will be slightly stronger too.
Atk speed itself is pretty worthless, as you'll be pretty much capped out even without BR/SOS.

Thus Crit dmg > P. Atk > Atk speed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElectroQQ View Post
Hello

I would just like to appending: Im DeLf summoner(lvl102) and summons buff +27% pattak only the basis pet pattak affect.
Nevermind its on Transform or how many pattak transfer to summon.
+27% always on basis pattak raise.

if by delf work this maybe EM buff +20% crit dmg its fix dmg work same as "critical dmg hat"( thats only theory) but if fix and not stack with pom sos
somebody can check this ?
I cant figure out what you are trying to say

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aranel View Post
The best dps summoner is elemental master bcs he have doble decrese pdef/mdef debuff, from yellow mark -30% pdef/mdef and freezing invoke (4 rune stone skill) -30% pdef/mdef, only for this elemental is the king of dps if we are talking about pets* dps.
False.
You cant debuff further than 50%, so any party with iss debuff + lumi from healer already cap it.
Even if you spam 500 different type of debuff, you wont make more damage.
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Old 01-21-2017, 08:21 AM   #6
ElectroQQ
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Znipoo


http://imgur.com/a/xEJ0t

i hope now understand. sorry for my english its bad
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Old 01-21-2017, 10:51 AM   #7
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

basic stats from 101 EM wynn , no 3sa on weapon http://imgur.com/a/4gFbw

Last edited by smokas; 01-21-2017 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 01-21-2017, 12:54 PM   #8
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

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Originally Posted by Znipoo View Post





False.
You cant debuff further than 50%, so any party with iss debuff + lumi from healer already cap it.
Even if you spam 500 different type of debuff, you wont make more damage.
I m not talking in party, i m talking about any wynn solo mode vs mob, elemental master is the king, and still elemental master the king in party, cant find the juji test about it, where elf class is the first, dark elf is the second and arcana lord the last on dps.
Best choice dark elf/ orc elemental master xD good str and c. damage bonus from pets.
I even can out dps with elemental master with same items lv99 vs arcana lord lv 100 LOL both mine, with 101 skills idk bcs i dont even have for test.
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Old 01-22-2017, 05:17 AM   #9
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by smokas View Post
basic stats from 101 EM wynn , no 3sa on weapon http://imgur.com/a/4gFbw
nice stats
+16 Retri ? (retri stats Pattak/mattak? )
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Old 04-28-2017, 02:26 PM   #10
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

The EM is better. The 101 Buff doesn't matter because the duration is low and the cooldown is fairly long (in comparison to the duration). Also, it's not as if the EM doesn't get a damage boost in it's buff, as well. Attack speed in the EM's buff is useful because the pets like likely not be capped in a solo scenario.

The EM can double debuff P.Def/M.Def, so their pet's hits will be significantly increased in a solos scenario. Freezing invoke is so good in this situation, that it's pretty much going to overpower that 20% P.Crit Damage for 30 seconds buff the SM gets on its own, and then some. Frankly, it isn't even close. The EM already has that 20% P.Crit damage, 100% of the time...

NCSoft gave the SM a worthless debuff for soloing, since they don't have Othell Pets. The EM Invoke is amazing for soloing, and the AL's debuff is much better than the SM's for soloing, since Attribute Defense is actually very useful to debuff this update.

So, while the SM will get 20% P.Critical Damage for 30 Seconds during that buff, the EM will buff 10% Attack Speed (all the rest is fairly equal) be able to keep additional -30% P.Def/M.Def debuff on the mob, virtually indefinitely. That's going to affect their pets' melee damage in a similar way to +P.Atk at the end of the day. It's simply better.

The immunity to debuffs is non-factor due to the fast cast and low reuse of Mass Servitor Blessing.

An SM will only outdamage an EM if there is gear disparity in its favor.

For parties the EM is still [generally] superior, especially if you're doing any kind of AoE, due to its ability to mass Debuff MOBs with Freezing Invoke. It slots in perfectly for both Physical and Magic AoE damage parties (Stacking with Devil's Curse, or with other AoE P.Def Debuffs).

For single target physical damage parties, the AL and SM can be better, depending on the party configuration. Debuffing Attribute Defense is very useful now, and if you're in a Dagger Party the SM's debuff will be the best option - though I'm unsure if players form parties centered around archetypes anymore, particularly daggers (with how much half kill resistance/immunity high level MOBs are popping up with)...
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Old 05-09-2017, 02:49 AM   #11
Pleistoros
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Im noob regarding wynn...Can you pls help me understand how you get to 120-130 str?
I mean wynn have mage basic stats...so, a wynn start from 40 str best scenario....
lets see:
+15 str dye
+3 from light set
+2 clo of light
+4 aria bracelet
+2 loging
+2 venir
+5 augumenting jewels
+10 more from jewels or whatever exhalted
so, till now we have 43+40=83...still long way to 120+
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Old 05-09-2017, 03:18 AM   #12
Attutmaruun
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleistoros View Post
Im noob regarding wynn...Can you pls help me understand how you get to 120-130 str?
I mean wynn have mage basic stats...so, a wynn start from 40 str best scenario....
lets see:
+15 str dye
+3 from light set
+2 clo of light
+4 aria bracelet
+2 loging
+2 venir
+5 augumenting jewels
+10 more from jewels or whatever exhalted
so, till now we have 43+40=83...still long way to 120+
Electro QQ is on transformation on that screen shot, it gives you warrior basic stats.
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Old 05-14-2017, 12:17 AM   #13
Icare
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Default Re: What would have higher dps?

You forget cute kitty

normal mode

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-8J0-q7cIITjR5UWRBNlRZQ28/view?usp=sharing

on transformation

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-...ew?usp=sharing

on transformation + dual berserker's rage active

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-...ew?usp=sharing
Enregistrer</span>
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